Hi Peter,
Peter, this is the wxPython-users list, not the Dabo-users list. I'm
aware of Dabo. Might even look into it some day. I'm less likely to do
that if someone keeps proselytizing so heavily and, in any case, I'm
finding it just a tad annoying to have to keep reading your strong
encouragements to go look at it. Would you please change the tone a
bit? I think others might feel the same.
OK, sorry if I offended anyone. Dabo's UI *is* wxPython, though, so
when I see someone struggling with those parts of wxPython that are,
shall we say, less than Pythonic, I want to be sure that they know
that they can have the best of both worlds: great wxPython UIs, but
without all those C++ remnants.
But when someone says they don't want Dabo, you typically proceed to try and get them to tell you why, and then often try to refute their arguments and push Dabo more. That, in my opinion, is where you go from "offering another option" to "becoming a salesperson". Instead of trying to convince people, you can just write a couple sentences, like "Dabo offers X or Y that might help you" and provide a link to the Dabo web site. And if the person says "I don't want to use Dabo", for any reason whatsoever, just leave it at that - drop it. They're adults (or maybe teenagers 
- they can visit web sites, read up on the alternatives, google it, etc.
IMHO by pushing Dabo too hard on people, you actually risk a backlash as the community gets tired of hearing about how Dabo is so great all the time. I say this as someone who thinks there is "more than enough room" for wxPython, Dabo and PythonCard and who would like to see all three toolkits continue to grow and improve.
I would agree that talking about specific Dabo issues is out of place
here, but letting someone who wants to use wxPython but is getting
stuck on some of the C++ crud know about a way to have their cake
(wxPython GUIs) and eat it too (Pythonic code) certainly seems
relevant. I know that a lot of the people on the dabo-users list are
like me: wxPython users who have found a better way to use it.
Please just limit
yourself to pointing out areas where Dabo might make something easier,
rather than referring to wxPython, and perhaps by association those of
us that use it, as "stupid".
Oh, come on. I called the constants 'stupid', not the people who end
up having to deal with them. I've also called them ugly, which they
are, but I think you're really stretching if you think that that, "by
association", means that you are ugly.
Perhaps not, but here's a question for you - what if I think they're neither 'stupid' or 'ugly'? You simply say that they "are" stupid and ugly - not that "you think" they are. So am I 'wrong' for thinking they're not, or do you feel that's a perfectly valid position?
I chose Python in large part because of its elegance and readability.
Sorry, but things like wx.EVT_GRID_CMD_LABEL_RIGHT_DCLICK are ugly and
stupid and have no place in Python code.
Who made you the judge of that? Why can't people decide that for themselves?
I don't know anyone who uses
wxPython *because* of stuff like that; instead, they use it *in spite
of* those shortcomings, because the results are worth it.
BTW, I don't use it because of it, but neither do I feel they're shortcomings. After having used many toolkits, I've found each has its own style, and each style has its benefits and drawbacks. The wxPython style is the wxPython style, and the Dabo style is the Dabo style. As I'm not particularly concerned about style, either toolkit is acceptable to me, and since I happen to know wxPython (and have wxPython code), I'm perfectly happy with it as a solution. And personally, I don't see any need to justify my choice to anyone.
Regards,
Kevin
ยทยทยท
On Nov 20, 2006, at 11:20 AM, Peter Decker wrote:
On 11/20/06, Peter Hansen <peter@engcorp.com> wrote:
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